school and UNI shootings in the USA (right to bare arms ridiculous!!)

[Y R U so Chunky]

If he is ten times stronger than me or has knife, then what?

[Rumblerege]

You hide. But thats unlikely, how many times have you had to defend yourself from an intruder?

[Y R U so Chunky]

Me personally, zero times.

But it could happen and I should have the right to protect myself at any cost in my own home or on my property.

[godsend]

Originally Posted by Y R U so Chunky

If someone breaks into my house to harm me, I have the right to defend myself and blast that ************ in the head.

Got it now?

I agree with you there Chunky but a gun is a dangerous commodity to have hold of.In the American military they give kids of 18 a big bad rifle and send them out to kill,these kids are mostly coloured and hispanic(in my experience)and aren't very well educated in the use and the effect of having to make such and important decision,like firing a gun.So i can see both side's for and against...but in the wrong hands gun are terrifying

[Rumblerege]

I still don't see the need to have something that was made to kill another person in your own home.

[Y R U so Chunky]

The guns themselves aren't the problem, I don't care what anyone says to me or any explanations they give me.

It's the people who are responsible for those guns that are the problem!!

At least lets all recognize that!!

[Y R U so Chunky]

Originally Posted by Rumblerege

I still don't see the need to have something that was made to kill another person in your own home.

To protect youself?

It's not a realistic solution to "hide". Because that may not always be possible. And you should never have to hide on your own property.

You may not agree with it, but you should at least be able to recognize the reasoning behind it.

[TattonG4]

Originally Posted by zzwampen

here's a question to the americans on this forum: do you have a gun in your home, or have you ever had a gun in your home?

I own 4 guns and a bow. No telling how many guns my dad owns. I really enjoy hunting (please don't go off topic on this, lol) and skeet and target shooting with my family and friends. I live in the south, and owning a gun is very common. Almost every male I know owns at least one gun (probably 80-90%), and if they don't own one, they have probably shot a gun at one point.

Why should American's have guns? I don't have an answer for that question, does "because we always have", work? I believe that we should have the right to do what we want (It is a free country). If you buy a gun "legally" (at an outdoors store) they do a background test on you. Convicted felons aren't allowed to have guns in the U.S. Our biggest problem is that you can buy a gun anywhere. For example, I bought one this fall from my dad's friend, no regestration or anything, and that is very common.

As far as the school shootings go... These people are psychotic, and even if they didn't have a gun, who is to say he couldn't have found another way to kill people (bombs, poisoining, etc). Guns are too easy to get access to here, but you can't stop idiots from doing idiotic things and that is evident in every country.

I have one question for you Europeans. How many of you could get access to a gun if you really wanted too?

I just found this looking for "gun killings in the U.S." on google. It is an old article from 2002, that was re-published today. There where several interesting articles that came up under the search.
Not Only in America: Gun Killings Shake the Europeans - New York Times

BBC News | In Pictures This is interesting too, it proves that America is by far the worst of industrialized countries. Other countries still have the same problems, just not to the same extent.

Sorry for writing the novel. I just want people to realize that one bad apple doesn't spoil the whole bunch. Although, three or four of them can.

[Y R U so Chunky]

Some excellent points in that post.

[Rumblerege]

i do see the reasoning, but i don't see why you wouldn't just have a taser or something a little bit less, err lethal?

[Y R U so Chunky]

Why should I have compasion for someone coming into my house illegally?

I have the right to take them out.

[TattonG4]

I agree with Chunky, why should I have any compassion for a person that comes into "my" house, trying to take "my" stuff. My dad keeps a loaded pistol in a safe place, but in easy reach if someone comes into "my" house. Me, I just have a golf club in reach.


Suspects charged with murder in Sean Taylor case - USATODAY.com
Ask Sean Taylor (link above) how well his machette worked. Off course, that argument is counter productive, because those "kids" should not have had guns.

[Rumblerege]

I don't know about you but i'm not sure i would be able to live with myself if i killed another person doesn't matter if they broke into your house they are still a human being with a family and feelings, probably driven to steal by society.

[TattonG4]

Originally Posted by Rumblerege

I don't know about you but i'm not sure i would be able to live with myself if i killed another person doesn't matter if they broke into your house they are still a human being with a family and feelings, probably driven to steal by society.

I don't think I could live with myself either, it would be a horrible expierence. However, if its him or my family, I choose him. I just hope to God that I am never put in that situation.

And as far as being being driven by society to steal, I am a strong believer in people being able to do whatever they put there mind too. Stealing won't help you get out of the hole that "society" has put you into. But, thats another topic for another day.

[Fowler Is God]

Wow..... pretty interesting so far. And fairly civil. Well done everyone.

I am a 36 year old American male, with a house, a family and a college education, two cars, a dog, etc. living a pretty typical suburban life in the Midwest.


I have never owned a gun, never will, and am continuously appalled at the ease which guns area availalble in this country. It is absolutely ridiculous, and is the MAIN cause behind shooting after shooting after shooting.... the ease with which guns are available both legally and illegally.

The "right to bear arms" was a very important ideal for the founders of this country, who had just faught a war with the British, using a volunteer army (albeit passionate), many without uniforms, any formal military trainining etc. I fully support the Constitution of this great nation, and although there are laws which I may diagree with, I can respect the rights others are provided by them. For what it's worth, I can support the right to bear arms... but I live in a different world than George Washington did. So do you.

But, the problem would not be solved by adding MORE guns to the equation... allowing MORE people to carry them, students who are armed going to class, etc.

The solution, imo, is to DRASTICALLY increase laws controlling who can be armed, and who cannot. That and to exponentially increase the penalties for those who DO carry guns and misuse them.

Commit a violent crime with a gun? You're done. Rights recinded permanently. Caught with an illegal gun at any point after that? Life in prison. PERIOD.

Have one in your car, and get pulled over and you are not properly licensed to carry it? Severe jail term.

Deal in illegal weapons, probably selling them to individuals who cannot get them legally? Life in prison. Period.

Commit a murder with a gun? Life in prison again.

The conservative camps who continuously fight for "lesser" restrictions on who can buy a gun (opposed to background checks, waiting lists, etc) in the name of the "right to bear arms" and the "the criminals have them, I have the right to blow their head off if they break into my house" are simply nuts imo. They surely do not realize that the rest of the civilized, educated world, laughs out loud at this opinion, as do I.

What law abiding American would not GLADLY go through several background checks and a waiting period TWICE as long as it is now to help weed out people who should NOT be buying guns? Let the checks and balances weed out these types of people, and let the new, HARD as HE11 penalties for crimes committed with guns weed out the criminals.

It may take a generation or two for American's to "get it" but does anyone really feel we are heading in the right direction regarding violent crimes with guns in this country? Frankly, I'm emabarrased by it.

Want to own a gun and hunt? Protect your family? Go for it. But do anything remotely inappropriate with it, and I have zero patience, or sympathy for you.

[Fowler Is God]

The "guns are available in supermarkets" statement is not factual. I work in the supermarket industry, on a 6 person team overseing 16 stores and about 6 million dollars in sales weekly for the USA's largest Food Store Company. There are no guns in supermarkets in the USA.

Stores that sell other types of sporting goods (hunting, footballs, outdoor stuff, clothing) often sell guns as well. The fact that a few companies (Wal Mart being the best known) have combined the food store with the sporting goods, furniture, electronics, etc. as well as guns, has led people to the wrong conclusion about supermarkets and guns.

[Y R U so Chunky]

Originally Posted by Fowler Is God

Want to own a gun and hunt? Protect your family? Go for it. But do anything remotely inappropriate with it, and I have zero patience, or sympathy for you.

Summed it up perfectly there.

I would also like to add that the owners of these guns in school shootings should be jailed and punished severly (if it was a parents gun, etc..).

[TattonG4]

Fowler,

I agree with you for the most part, and I am one of those far right conservatives. Harsher penalties and stricter laws will help. Waiting for a background check is annoying, but I understand the reasoning behind it. But, as I said earlier, the biggest problem is the ease at which people can get obtain a gun through illegal methods.

You are definately right about people carrying guns to protect themselves, it won't solve anything. It will just lead to more accidental shootings.

And as you said, the constitution was written 200 years ago, and the right to bare arms has more to do with the states having a militia, then everyone being able to own a gun.

[TattonG4]

I dont think this was national news, but do you guys remeber the Jonesboro, AR school shooting from 10 or so years ago. The younger kid was released from juvie in the last couple of years with a clean record. Well about a month or two ago he was arrested for possession of drugs and a firearm. He should be in prison for the rest of his life. The sad part is it won't be because it is a "1st" offense.

(I don't know where I am going with these arguments, I think I am being counter productive .)
As I said earlier, every society has idiots that do idiotic things. As the old saying goes, "guns don't kill people, people kill people."

[Fowler Is God]

Originally Posted by TattonG4

Fowler,

I agree with you for the most part, and I am one of those far right conservatives.

And I am not nearly as far left as my opinion on this subject might suggest. far from it actually. I like the far right MUCH more than the far left, no doubt about it. I'm more in the middle, able to use "both feet" if I were a striker, but definitely right footed.

[KrytenPlay]

i rekon the u.s should at least do better background checks. And not just give any yahoo a gun.

[zzwampen]

Originally Posted by Y R U so Chunky

If someone breaks into my house to harm me, I have the right to defend myself and blast that ************ in the head.

Got it now?

how often does that happen? that a guy tries to break in to your house with the sole purpose of killing you without you having done something?