Fifa is not football

JC83 · 26-07-2008, 05:04 PM

I say this because you really don't have to know anything about or play football to be any good at this game, height, speed and power is all you need, there is absolutely no skill required.

Initially I was impressed with Fifa 08 - it's the first one I have played since switching to PES in 2004 but now I can't help but think that this year's game has fluked success owing to the terrible effort from Konami.

Initially a hack button, then goals from almost anywhere on the pitch, free kicks and corners with arrows, useless off the ball control system, beapro has been quite good but there's nothing to it and now it's just cutbacks and triple taps .... the whole time the gameplay supporting these gimmicks has been at best second-rate even if EA have said it will improve every year.

This year we have a collision system and 50,000 tactical combinations to choose from. What's wrong with a simple and easy to use formation editor with a few tactical options? Why do we need a 'new revolutionary collision system' when they haven't even sorted out the normal gameplay?

Every year they punch above their weight and end up back where they started. Isn't it about time that EA stopped with all the computer-game gimmicks and started concentrating on football instead?

Let's hope i'm wrong and Fifa 09 is the game we have all been eagerly anticipating, but EA better realise that 08 has been so successful because thousands of PES fans were short-changed, and if they want to keep their new following they will need something more than a few gimmicks.

r0000ney · 26-07-2008, 05:06 PM

Have you played the Euro 2008 game?

JusTeken · 26-07-2008, 05:11 PM

Seems like you're a bit bitter...

I think that those who really fancies football/soccer, watches daily games, plays soccer themselves etc. has a huge advantage in the game when it comes to game vision, team choosing, tactics etc. Including me

JC83 · 26-07-2008, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by r0000ney

Have you played the Euro 2008 game?

nah only the demo but it's had mixed reviews and personally I think the whole Euro game thing is just a gimmick in itself, besides I doubt anyone has played it for long enough to see what's wrong with it.

Sos i'm being judgmental but I've been fooled by EA several times before.

blaccatdadon · 26-07-2008, 05:14 PM

i guess u have to be a heavyweight wbc champ to be good at fight night

Pepski · 26-07-2008, 05:17 PM

To be fair, PES may have had the gameplay sorted (until the latest edition), but each & every one of them was also plagued by major flaws.

PES6 was unbelievably prone to cut-backs. PES5 gave you the ability to score every freekick by laying it off. PES4 (I think it was) had the COM constantly passing the ball to the edge of the area, with no positional awareness.

The new collision system sounds utterly brilliant, and it will play a major part on the gameplay, as it will come into play everytime 2 players go near eachother. If EA balls it up then the gameplay will be awful, but if they get it right we could have the best football simulation going.

The tactical differences of teams was a bit excessive in Euro, with teams like Andorra shutting out England for a 0-0 draw every time (many would argue this was quite realistic though

). It could work wonders in 09, and being able to customise them is great!

JC83 · 26-07-2008, 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JusTeken

Seems like you're a bit bitter...

I think that those who really fancies football/soccer, watches daily games, plays soccer themselves etc. has a huge advantage in the game when it comes to game vision, team choosing, tactics etc. Including me

I thought that myself, and it would be true if the players in the game had as much vision lol I'm fed up with my teammates running away from or over the ball, or just plain standing there and letting it hit them. I'm also fed up with my LB or RB playing everyone onside 'by a country mile' lol

JC83 · 26-07-2008, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pepski

To be fair, PES may have had the gameplay sorted (until the latest edition), but each & every one of them was also plagued by major flaws.

PES6 was unbelievably prone to cut-backs. PES5 gave you the ability to score every freekick by laying it off. PES4 (I think it was) had the COM constantly passing the ball to the edge of the area, with no positional awareness.

The new collision system sounds utterly brilliant, and it will play a major part on the gameplay, as it will come into play everytime 2 players go near eachother. If EA balls it up then the gameplay will be awful, but if they get it right we could have the best football simulation going.

The tactical differences of teams was a bit excessive in Euro, with teams like Andorra shutting out England for a 0-0 draw every time (many would argue this was quite realistic though

). It could work wonders in 09, and being able to customise them is great!

I think the whole cutbacks thing is just down to people's mentality going into the game, generally I suppose the people I was playing PES against were my team-mates in real life, so we just wanted a quality football game and I didn't find cutbacks that much of an issue, so i'll take ur word for it.

regarding the rest ^ I agree with what you said, I'm just fed up of 'it could be' or 'it sounds like' or 'maybe' or 'if' - would you put money on it being as great as EA say it is? I thought a lot of EA's gimmicks sounded great but none of them exist today and they could have spent their time much more wisely. Like I said I hope I'm wrong

sleepzbmrl · 26-07-2008, 05:29 PM

When you actualy think about it, what JC83 is talking alot of sense

JusTeken · 26-07-2008, 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JC83

I thought that myself, and it would be true if the players in the game had as much vision lol I'm fed up with my teammates running away from or over the ball, or just plain standing there and letting it hit them. I'm also fed up with my LB or RB playing everyone onside 'by a country mile' lol

I understand what you mean, some people just do the same tactics over and over again. During to my own experiences they don't do very well, since I've practised a lot on defensive tactics against such as cutbacks, wing runs, C RONALDO etc.

I hope that FIFA 09 requires a smarter playing from the player, so that it could be more interesting games!

Pepski · 26-07-2008, 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JC83

regarding the rest ^ I agree with what you said, I'm just fed up of 'it could be' or 'it sounds like' or 'maybe' or 'if' - would you put money on it being as great as EA say it is? I thought a lot of EA's gimmicks sounded great but none of them exist today and they could have spent their time much more wisely. Like I said I hope I'm wrong

I can understand why you're a bit hestitant in reagrds to a new FIFA. I've been a PES fan between 2 and 6, but found 2008 so bad (and FIFA08 so good) that I've been playing FIFA all this year. I've been very impressed with the gameplay of Euro this Summer, and am generally just an optimist!

Quote:

Originally Posted by JusTeken

I hope that FIFA 09 requires a smarter playing from the player, so that it could be more interesting games!

Hence why I'm looking forward to the manual control filter for online this year.

JC83 · 26-07-2008, 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JusTeken

I understand what you mean, some people just do the same tactics over and over again. During to my own experiences they don't do very well, since I've practised a lot on defensive tactics against such as cutbacks, wing runs, C RONALDO etc.

I hope that FIFA 09 requires a smarter playing from the player, so that it could be more interesting games!

Well exactly, I actually have my own gimmick to sort out the fan-boys (see sig)

There's another word, while I too 'hope' that 09 will be great I would much rather feel sure because EA always produce the goods, the fact is they don't

JC83 · 26-07-2008, 05:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pepski

I can understand why you're a bit hestitant in reagrds to a new FIFA. I've been a PES fan between 2 and 6, but found 2008 so bad (and FIFA08 so good) that I've been playing FIFA all this year. I've been very impressed with the gameplay of Euro this Summer, and am generally just an optimist!

Hence why I'm looking forward to the manual control filter for online this year.

I wish I could be as optimistic as you are, i think it's all this talking about 09 while playing 08 that's got me vexed - mind you, if i'm pessimistic at least I won't be disappointed lol (yeh right)

Pepski · 26-07-2008, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JC83

There's another word, while I too 'hope' that 09 will be great I would much rather feel sure because EA always produce the goods, the fact is they don't

Yeah I think that's the thread I posted in. Brilliant idea mate, probably the best suggestion I've read, and would go a long way in also stopping the same old tactics being used.

Passing the ball to Ronaldo over & over again is so ****ing annoying! If the little gimp was knackered after 70mins, would certainly help matters.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JC83

I wish I could be as optimistic as you are, i think it's all this talking about 09 while playing 08 that's got me vexed - mind you, if i'm pessimistic at least I won't be disappointed lol (yeh right)

That's why I'm becoming less & less optimistic as a Liverpool fan. Means that if we win at home to Hull I'll be delighted!

JC83 · 26-07-2008, 06:37 PM

^Aw but u guys are so optimistic, think what it's like to be a Luton fan!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by blaccatdadon

i guess u have to be a heavyweight wbc champ to be good at fight night

What do you mean?

Pepski · 26-07-2008, 06:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JC83

^Aw but u guys are so optimistic, think what it's like to be a Luton fan!!

Wow, that's put things into perspective. I'm now a much happier football fan.

Hjerpseth · 26-07-2008, 07:22 PM

No skill required? So what you're saying is that the game is to easy then? Swith from Semi-pro to world class, or at least proffesional, play manual, challenge better players...

I'm not saying I'm a world class player, but I do think that I can win most of my games because of my skill and not because the 360 helps me to.

If the game required no skill, how come the top 10 guys in the world could(I'm not saying you're a bad player) beat you 5-0? Skill mate

Xaor · 26-07-2008, 07:31 PM

FIFA 08's only major problem is the emphasis on luck, and the exploits. It's too easy to use the wings. Proper defending is less effective than charge defending. Tackles often only half work, and end up in a worse situation than before (you tackle, but he gets the ball back). Lateral passes. Generally awful goalkeeping and defender AI. That's what ruins FIFA 08.

Games are won, almost all the time between similarly skilled opponents on total fluke, and that is a disaster.

Wepeeler · 26-07-2008, 07:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blaccatdadon

i guess u have to be a heavyweight wbc champ to be good at fight night

Duh! I thought this was common knowledge!

Just look at me laughing at my opponents:

and then: YouTube - Fight Night Round 3 - Wepeeler's Knockouts

Striking resemblance, imho

As for FIFA, you still need to know how to play the real game of footie...

Kellog_G8 · 26-07-2008, 07:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JusTeken

Seems like you're a bit bitter...

I think that those who really fancies football/soccer, watches daily games, plays soccer themselves etc. has a huge advantage in the game when it comes to game vision, team choosing, tactics etc. Including me

Agreed.

NickSCFC · 26-07-2008, 07:44 PM

From the brief play of FIFA 09 I had I have to say it feels alot like PES 6 but less on-rails

JC83 · 26-07-2008, 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hjerpseth

No skill required? So what you're saying is that the game is to easy then? Swith from Semi-pro to world class, or at least proffesional, play manual, challenge better players...

I'm not saying I'm a world class player, but I do think that I can win most of my games because of my skill and not because the 360 helps me to.

If the game required no skill, how come the top 10 guys in the world could(I'm not saying you're a bad player) beat you 5-0? Skill mate

Dude I'm not moaning about losing, and yes this game is easy (unless you play legendary and they just run in circles)

Don't get me started on the top players, the majority of which play as manu or barca, use lag switches, and just rape the wings every time they get the ball. It doesn't take much skill to run the fastest player in the game down the side of the pitch now does it!?

JC83 · 26-07-2008, 08:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NickSCFC

From the brief play of FIFA 09 I had I have to say it feels alot like PES 6 but less on-rails

Fair do's I'm not sure how to take that, do you mean the gameplay felt solid, consistent, or dated? No-rails sounds excellent though.

NickSCFC · 26-07-2008, 08:08 PM

Reaction to controls is quicker, especially with dribbling, pretty much instant like PES2008.

Also the balls feels really solid compared to FIFA 08, feels like PES 5 when passing it around.

I've only played a bit with the Assited controls on (PES style), so Manual may feel a bit different.

JC83 · 26-07-2008, 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NickSCFC

Reaction to controls is quicker, especially with dribbling, pretty much instant like PES2008.

Also the balls feels really solid compared to FIFA 08, feels like PES 5 when passing it around.

I've only played a bit with the Assited controls on (PES style), so Manual may feel a bit different.

Thanks for the info mate, much appreciated. Have u played PES aswell or just Fifa?

26-07-2008, 05:04 PM	#1 (permalink)
JC83 Forum Junkie Join Date: Jun 2008 Age: 26 Posts: 4,346	Fifa is not football I say this because you really don't have to know anything about or play football to be any good at this game, height, speed and power is all you need, there is absolutely no skill required. Initially I was impressed with Fifa 08 - it's the first one I have played since switching to PES in 2004 but now I can't help but think that this year's game has fluked success owing to the terrible effort from Konami. Initially a hack button, then goals from almost anywhere on the pitch, free kicks and corners with arrows, useless off the ball control system, beapro has been quite good but there's nothing to it and now it's just cutbacks and triple taps .... the whole time the gameplay supporting these gimmicks has been at best second-rate even if EA have said it will improve every year. This year we have a collision system and 50,000 tactical combinations to choose from. What's wrong with a simple and easy to use formation editor with a few tactical options? Why do we need a 'new revolutionary collision system' when they haven't even sorted out the normal gameplay? Every year they punch above their weight and end up back where they started. Isn't it about time that EA stopped with all the computer-game gimmicks and started concentrating on football instead? Let's hope i'm wrong and Fifa 09 is the game we have all been eagerly anticipating, but EA better realise that 08 has been so successful because thousands of PES fans were short-changed, and if they want to keep their new following they will need something more than a few gimmicks. __________________ WWW.TAMFA.COM Last edited by JC83; 26-07-2008 at 07:18 PM..

26-07-2008, 05:14 PM	#5 (permalink)
blaccatdadon Forum Guru Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 1,687	i guess u have to be a heavyweight wbc champ to be good at fight night __________________ SUBCRIBE TO MY YOUTUBE CHANNEL www.youtube.com/theblaccat Manual Fifa Goals compilation and Tutorials, Thank you

26-07-2008, 07:22 PM	#17 (permalink)
Hjerpseth Forum Regular Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Norway Age: 16 Gender: Male Posts: 804	No skill required? So what you're saying is that the game is to easy then? Swith from Semi-pro to world class, or at least proffesional, play manual, challenge better players... I'm not saying I'm a world class player, but I do think that I can win most of my games because of my skill and not because the 360 helps me to. If the game required no skill, how come the top 10 guys in the world could(I'm not saying you're a bad player) beat you 5-0? Skill mate __________________ Please check out my YouTube videos!

26-07-2008, 07:31 PM	#18 (permalink)
Xaor Forum Junkie Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Devon Posts: 3,284	FIFA 08's only major problem is the emphasis on luck, and the exploits. It's too easy to use the wings. Proper defending is less effective than charge defending. Tackles often only half work, and end up in a worse situation than before (you tackle, but he gets the ball back). Lateral passes. Generally awful goalkeeping and defender AI. That's what ruins FIFA 08. Games are won, almost all the time between similarly skilled opponents on total fluke, and that is a disaster. __________________ Gamertag: The Trebuchet What's Wrong With FIFA: 1: The problems with assists 2: Why the Pressure Buttons Must Go 3: Why you are the problem

26-07-2008, 07:44 PM	#21 (permalink)
NickSCFC Rookie Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 434	From the brief play of FIFA 09 I had I have to say it feels alot like PES 6 but less on-rails __________________ FIFA 10 demo out 10 September 2010

26-07-2008, 05:06 PM	#2 (permalink)
r0000ney Banned Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: United Kingdom Gender: Male Posts: 3,255	Have you played the Euro 2008 game?

26-07-2008, 05:11 PM	#3 (permalink)
JusTeken Rookie Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Gothenburg, Sweden Posts: 327	Seems like you're a bit bitter... I think that those who really fancies football/soccer, watches daily games, plays soccer themselves etc. has a huge advantage in the game when it comes to game vision, team choosing, tactics etc. Including me

26-07-2008, 05:17 PM	#6 (permalink)
Pepski Rookie Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Portsmouth Age: 21 Posts: 444	To be fair, PES may have had the gameplay sorted (until the latest edition), but each & every one of them was also plagued by major flaws. PES6 was unbelievably prone to cut-backs. PES5 gave you the ability to score every freekick by laying it off. PES4 (I think it was) had the COM constantly passing the ball to the edge of the area, with no positional awareness. The new collision system sounds utterly brilliant, and it will play a major part on the gameplay, as it will come into play everytime 2 players go near eachother. If EA balls it up then the gameplay will be awful, but if they get it right we could have the best football simulation going. The tactical differences of teams was a bit excessive in Euro, with teams like Andorra shutting out England for a 0-0 draw every time (many would argue this was quite realistic though ). It could work wonders in 09, and being able to customise them is great!

26-07-2008, 08:08 PM	#24 (permalink)
NickSCFC Rookie Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 434	Reaction to controls is quicker, especially with dribbling, pretty much instant like PES2008. Also the balls feels really solid compared to FIFA 08, feels like PES 5 when passing it around. I've only played a bit with the Assited controls on (PES style), so Manual may feel a bit different. __________________ FIFA 10 demo out 10 September 2010