BF2 Update 1.50 Security Features

[AbsurdusOffline]

Originally Posted by VectorRoll

Yes an A-10...My favorite. Their is a good mod that has it. Of coarse the Tank fans my not want it. If it is at all designed like it is supposed to be.

Not that warthog lol, the one from Halo.

[Fat_Swinub]

Originally Posted by Bazajaytee

underpowered in comparison. The F35 is VTOL so its never going to be as fast as a J10 either. Also the J10 has canards to aid turning.

Nice bit of flying showing that the F25 isn't always air fodder: YouTube - *666*Sparrow F-35 vs J-10's

Yes the guy does seem to know his stuff when flying I'll give him that. Yes I do notice that some missiles lose lock when the J10's turn

This isn't a post to say its all good, just to point to its possible to fight the J10.

"Yes I do notice that some missiles lose lock when the J10's turn"

Do you acknowledge that the F-35B can't do this? No matter how hard you pull the mouse, push the joystick or mash a key, you will never evade a missile through simple turning unlike literally every other jet/bomber in the game. The imbalance isn't in the F-35B's ability to kill the J-10, it's the F-35B's lack of missile dodging ability. Short of using an unintended game mechanic to make the F-35 faster than the missile tracking it, you'll never dodge a single missile without flares.

[JGrasli]

FatSwinub01 said it right. The problem (the imbalance) is that the F-35b cant dodge (get away from) the missiles from other planes. Using the F-35b you simply cant get away from the missiles coming against you, the missiles alwaylalalala you due to too high hitboxes. The hitboxes on the F-35b are too big, and that needs to be fixed.

BF2: Aviator | trackr
Info on the planes in BF2. If you click on each plane you can see some small black pictures of the planes. The size of the planes are not that different you see, but still the hitboxes on the F-35b are way too big. Once again, thats the problem.

[VectorRoll]

Originally Posted by AbsurdusOffline

Not that warthog lol, the one from Halo.

OH...Well then forget that. I do not want any Halo stuff in this game.

[VectorRoll]

I personally do not know the exact shape of the hitboxes for said planes. But a sane theory on what they should be is this.
The hitboxes should be the same shape as the plan. So if one plane is smaller than the other then the hit box should in respect be smaller. It just makes sense to stick with that idea when looking at it. Just as long as the bullets or missiles actually hit the plane. You do not want them to come close and count as a hit. Unless it is meant to explode right before impact throwing shrapnel into the target. You do not want them to be identical. They should all have the pros and cons. Like one having better maneuverability while the other has better speed, and so on. After all they are not equally matched in the the real world.

But this is just a game. And their are issues with the with the jets and helicopter; which is why I do think that it needs to be looked at. But I do not think that both sides should have the same pros and cons as well as same hit boxes.
Any ways that is how I think it should be.

[bctrainers1]

If there's something in BF2 that is annoying when AT, it would be the rocket goes right through said vehicle. Fixing that up once and for all would be nice.

[SkankwOn]

Originally Posted by Drw584

Why not put F18's on the carriers instead.

GOOD point! They fare much better vs J-10s!

[JGrasli]

VectorRoll: Yeah I know. But as I said earlier the F-18 is a big plane as well (just as big as the F-35b), and it seems like it does not have the problem.
Maybe the problem is in the flares? That the F-35b's flares doesnt do anything. Maybe they dont attract the missiles away from the plane?

Anyway, I still stand with my statement on the F-35b'lalalalaboxes being too big. Both the F-35b and the F-18 are big planes, but only one of them has this problem.
Do you see the point? Do you read me?

[VectorRoll]

I understood what you were getting at and I did not disagree with it.

Like said before I do not know what the hitboxes are. It would be nice to know this if at all possible. I just said that they should be the same shape as the plane. At least in theory.
I do not disagree that their are issues with it at all. Their is something quite funny with them that is why I said that they do need to be looked at.

As for the flares I too have noticed that they do nothing. From flying it and from the ground while looking at pilots use them. Seeing it from the ground really shows that compared to actually being the person that used them. The missiles seem to fly right by them some times.

[Bazajaytee]

Originally Posted by JGrasli

BF2: Aviator | trackr
Info on the planes in BF2. If you click on each plane you can see some small black pictures of the planes. The size of the planes are not that different you see, but still the hitboxes on the F-35b are way too big. Once again, thats the problem.

The F35 is wider and has two tail fins instead of one.
Changing the hitbox on the F35 won't make it easier to attack the J10, it'd just make it harder to hit the F35. Even thats not a guarantee since the F35 doesn't have the turning abilities of the J10 to evade missiles.

[Bazajaytee]

Originally Posted by SkankwOn

GOOD point! They fare much better vs J-10s!

Maybe they would but then where would we put the F35's?

[JGrasli]

Bazajaytee:
It should'nt be easier to attack the J-10 either. I have never, never, ever said that. Its fine. But it should be harder to hit the F-35b!

Yeah that is what we have been asking for: making it harder to hit the F-35b.

Currently its very easy to hit the F-35b and medium hard to hit the J-10. What we want is medium hard to hit the F-35b as well.

Got my point? Its currently too easy to hit the F-35b, and Im surprised if you havent seen that yet. Thats why we have the imbalance - its sooo easy to hit the F-35b. Fix it, problem solved, happy people, happy game

Hitting the J-10 is fine. It may be hard for some but if you have skill thats no problem. Making it just as hard to hit the F-35b will fix the imbalance problem we have today.


Okay: Do you get me now? We like the way it currently is to hit the J-10. But its too easy to hit the F-35b. Therefore we have been asking about changing the hitbox on the F-35b so it becomes harder to hit it, so we get a real fight in the air. Please DICE, please try to understand me. I want a real fight in the air, not one side having planes that OVERKILL the other one. I repeat: hitting the J-10 is fine. Hitting the F-35b is NOT fine -> its too easy. Dont care about the turning ability, but change the hitbox on the F-35b cause the missiles will currently alwaylalalala it no matter what. Make it harder to hit the F-35b. Got it?

DICE, the developers of the best game in the world, you can fix this. You CAN make it harder to hit the F-35b so we get rid of this imbalance. I know you can. Please.
Keep up the good work with Patch 1.50!

*EDIT*: Oh, that got into a long text. Heh :P

[Bazajaytee]

What I see people saying is that they want smaller hitboxes on the F35 which isn't the solution as VectorRoll mentioned. It'd be swapping one issue of being harder to evade missiles in the F35 than the J10 to having missiles pass into the model of the F35 to reach the hitbox inside.

[JGrasli]

What if you do these things then (both of them):

- Make the F-35blalalalaboxes slightly smaller
- Make the J-10lalalalaboxes slightly bigger

Note: I said "slightly" on both, meaning changing the hitboxes slightly slightly. If you do that on both, then we can say the issue has been fixed, ey?

I see it myself now, this sounds much better. Can you consider this? Note I said "slightly"..

[Ustanotbesoham]

Originally Posted by Bazajaytee

What I see people saying is that they want smaller hitboxes on the F35 which isn't the solution as VectorRoll mentioned. It'd be swapping one issue of being harder to evade missiles in the F35 than the J10 to having missiles pass into the model of the F35 to reach the hitbox inside.

For the sake of clarity, the issue everybody is talking about is the same, only the solution to the problem is different.

The issue is that the f35 is too easy to hit, compared to the other planes.

The solution? Some people suggest modifying the hitbox, others suggest changing the missiles, others swapping planes etc. I think people will be happy with whatever solution Dice decides on, as long as the issue is resolved.

I don't like flying so I really don't care what happens, honestly. But this is -- by far -- the most requested bug fix in the game. I apologize for trying to speak for everybody, but I just want to make sure baza is clear on what people are asking for. This forum can be very hectic and confusing sometimes

[JGrasli]

Yeah. I hope the issue gets fixed in some way. Please DICE, I hope you fix it.
Maybe the solution is not the hitboxes as you said (apologize Baz), but maybe give the F-35b more afterbuner, a better turning ability etc. Or if it is the hitboxes, maybe changing both plane'lalalalaboxes as I said above is a good idea.

As long as you fix the issue DICE - Good job!
Please reply.

[Drw584]

Originally Posted by Bazajaytee

Maybe they would but then where would we put the F35's?

Just leave them on maps like Oman & Zatar, the Mig 29 doesn't seem to be as bad.

[Preite8]

Just put the f18s in dalian.

Or maybe replace this missiles with the 1.2 missiles (the zig zag ones) :P

[JGrasli]

Stop joking here.. :P
The F-35b can be fixed in someway, I know it. Just remember that the problem is that its too easy to hit it.. I hope to see a fix for this problem.

And yes I agree with VectorRoll about different settings on the different sides. Now as the J-10 is hard to hit, maybe the F-35b can have MORE afterburner, more speed and so on? And the maneuverability should be improved a little bit as well, since its a huge difference between the two planes on that.

I wonder why I havent thought more about that before.. Heh. DICE - have you had that in mind and are trying with more afterburner/more flares, more speed and so on for the F-35b? That would be great, and you may not need to fix the hitboxes either..
Keep up the good work!

[AbsurdusOffline]

bit more info in this post

[JGrasli]

Oh, well well.
This post have pictures that proves the problem with the F-35b and the J-10. On the J-10 the heatsource is longer inside the body of the plane, making it harder to hit it. On the F-35b, the heatsource is the opposite - it should be longer inside.

And on the F-35b, the collision mesh is too big - its actually bigger than the plane itself. Havent I said the whole time that hitboxes was the problem?

J-10 Problems VS F-35 Problems

[Fat_Swinub]

Originally Posted by Bazajaytee

What I see people saying is that they want smaller hitboxes on the F35 which isn't the solution as VectorRoll mentioned. It'd be swapping one issue of being harder to evade missiles in the F35 than the J10 to having missiles pass into the model of the F35 to reach the hitbox inside.

As long as that's balanced, what's the problem? Throw those modified F-35 hitboxes into the 1.5 open beta and let us decide if it's a problem.

[JGrasli]

Yeah, make the F-35blalalalaboxes a little bit smaller and make the collision mesh a little bit smaller (currently its a lot bigger than the plane itself according to the link below). After doing that you can throw it into Patch 1.5 Beta and see how it goes. Believe me, as we all have said before, the missiles fired at F-35b will almost alwaylalalala due to the too big hitboxes/collision meshes. Therefore thats the thing that needs fixing (making the hitboxes a little bit smaller).

Look at the link below - look at the heat sources, look at the collision meshes:
J-10 Problems VS F-35 Problems

[FireryFox]

just dont forget about the "hitreg" "hit detection" or "netcode" of everything else..

to fire a eryx straight through a car or a tv guided missile straight through a helicopter or jet,
or to fire on others soldiers and hit, but miss anyway,
when you have 25ms ping and the other have 25ms ping as well, is not acceptable in a FPS

[kosh0r]

Originally Posted by Bazajaytee

Thanks for brining this up, we'll take a look at throw distances.

i really hope so!

@ the f35 problem: just decrease the turnrate of the j10s/mig29s missiles

ok, that may affekt the other jets.
solution

if (missile.target.get_type() = "F35")
{
turnvec = Vec2f(x,x);
}
else
{
turnvec = Vec2f(y,y);
}


// y > x

this would be a solution.